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Friday, 2 September 2011

"Carrie Modral Put's The Twisted (Astrid Kisch) Record Straight"

Ill-informed views on care leavers

Carrie at the London Rally Against Child Abuse

From Carrie Modral, chairman, 'Jersey Care Leavers Association'.
THE letter (JEP, Tuesday 30 August) from Astrid Kisch cannot be allowed to go unchallenged.
Overall, this lady appears to have a very ill-informed and blinkered knowledge of the child abuse issues and the ensuing matters, and if we may be permitted we would like to put the record and facts straight.

Why do we have to give our money? From Astrid Kisch

"I AM puzzled. The alleged perpetrators of the care home discipline of those days have been convicted, so the revenge part has been dealt with and the wrongs righted-at great expense to the taxpayer. The care leavers have grown up and made their lives a long time ago. Now, I understand, they are asking for 'compensation' by which I assume they mean money.
Question: Why do other people i.e.the taxpayers,have to give them money and for what purpose?"

Villa Martinique, Chemin du Moulin, St. Ouen.
Telephone 01534 482599
Left me speachless.

Firstly she mentions the ‘alleged’ perpetrators. Does she mean by this that innocent people have been brought to justice for their deeds? They are not alleged, because they have been found guilty in a court of law.

Furthermore not all perpetrators have been brought to justice. Revenge does not enter into the equation – doing the right and lawful thing does. Crimes were committed and those guilty had to be accountable. It really is that simple.

Now we are puzzled. Mrs Kisch talks about the ‘care home discipline of those days’.
Is she saying that severe sexual, physical and mental abuse was in the past acceptable discipline? We are not talking about a slapped wrist or a smacked bottom, but far, far worse than that. I do not think she will find many people in agreement with what was acceptable or not however long ago she may be talking about.

Indeed, the care leavers have grown up, but not necessarily ‘made their lives’. Many have been left very damaged by what they experienced and will have to live with the legacy of that for the rest of their lives. Some are unable to work and others have many various issues because of the scars that have been left both mentally and physically. Has Mrs Kisch ever spoken to or made any attempt to understand what some survivors suffered and indeed still do.

However, all these most important facts seem to be overlooked by what seems to be the main bugbear and that is compensation, which seems to be a very dirty word in Mrs Kisch’s book. Yes – compensation. Is that really too much to ask for lives damaged, childhoods (as she may have known it) lost and something abuse victims can never get back. Furthermore, it appears that with the attitude displayed in her letter Mrs Kisch is causing the victims to be victims yet again.

There has never been any question that compensation would not, or should not be claimed. Children, who for various reasons (and not because they were difficult), were placed either in care homes or residential homes under the supervision of people paid by the States of Jersey to give them the love, affection and nurturing that would have been afforded them in a normal home environment.

The fact that in many instances this did not happen, in fact quite the opposite, leaves the blame fairly and squarely at the door of the States of Jersey for failing these children. Indeed in Ireland most of the Catholic orders and institutions where abuse took place contributed sums of money to the redress scheme for survivors there. Here in Jersey, it is only the government who are accountable.

At present we are unsure whether the States have an indemnity insurance that will cover this, or how the compensation will be paid, but I am sure there are not many people who would begrudge this in any way, shape or form.

Finally, Mrs Kisch would be most welcome to visit our offices should she so wish to learn more about why we are here and the issues we deal with. Better an informed public than an uninformed letter.

Carrie Modral

Please also see Trevor Pitman's blog with regard to the pathetic attempts at reporting by Jersey's child abuse sponsoring main stream media. See the green link below.



  1. Astrid Kisch, we can only pity your heartless blinkered outlook on life.

    Had you been raped in the care of the States of Jersey at the tender age of five, would you still hold your twisted views?

    People like you, are the reason there are people like us!!!


  2. I am not a care leaver or ever had any problems growing up but I am decent enough to realise that letter from Astrid Kisch is disgusting. It beggars belief that anyone would write a letter like that knowing it will be published. what a disgrace of a human being.

  3. Such a condescending tone from the letter writer I wonder why?

    There is always the possibility some never grew up, nor moved on but took a different way out.

  4. Disgraceful.

  5. I hope, Astrid Kisch, that your god is smiling upon you, I really do.

    As no one else is.

    The rather annoyed Beano is not the Rag

  6. Sounds like Kisch is, or was, an abuser at some stage, what other explanation can there be for her vile outburst?

  7. Astrid Kisch is a very nice gentle lady but she is in denial of, or ignorant about, the whole truth.

  8. What a tragedy it would be for your island if outsiders believed this Kisch person represented typical Jersey compassion. She should be considered about as sympathetic as a Nazi. Horrid woman!

  9. No, she's just privileged and ignorant of other people's circumstances.

    Well done Carrie, and Ozzy for his latest (can't comment there anon).

  10. Hi Ian

    That has got to be one of the most disgusting letters I have ever read in the JEP. I don't remember them publishing her phone number though. If they did then fair play but if they didn't then I would suggest you remove it. She is an old lady who has expressed the good old Jersey right wing conservative point of view and people have responded but the phone number worries me for the simple reason as there is no need .


  11. Well said Carrie.


  12. I had a chat with Astrid Kisch about two years ago, and I and my wife had the impression that Mr and Mrs Kirch live in " A world of their own"
    It reminded me of the st. Ouinnies who I went to school with, in the 1950´s They seemed to live in a "World of their own".

    No disrespect ment to anyone who lives in the parish of St. Ouen.

  13. I have posted this before on Stuart's site but I'll put finger to keyboard once more.

    When the child abuse investigations were under way and the cover ups were starting to surface, my grand mother-in-law said it was such a shame that these investigations were taking place. It should all be dropped as she believed it all happened in the long distance past.

    On pushing her a little bit more on this subject to try and understand her reasoning, she said that it is unfair on the families of the abusers ... no less.

    When I said that do you think it is wrong for the Jewish state to pursue the genocidal maniacs from WWII I was met with stunned silence, She had no reply. But then again, she was here during the occupation and is on record as saying that she had a great time.

    As my grand mother-in-law was party to her husband physically abusing her two children, one of whom was then party to the beating of her children (one of whom is my spouse) I agree with anonymous at 01:05. There can be no other reason...... apart from the Kisch household doing a favour for someone to try and destroy the credibility of the anti-abuse campaign.

    The Beano is not the Rag

  14. Anonymous wrote: "Sounds like Kisch is, or was, an abuser at some stage, what other explanation can there be for her vile outburst"

    Or that she is protecting someone? I too have written a letter to the editor along very similar lines to Carrie's. If it doesn't get printed I will post it on the blogs.

    Proud Survivor


  16. The victims are now just pawns
    September 5, 2008 – 3:00 pm

    From Astrid Kisch.
    IT all started with compassion but Senator Stuart Syvret’s Haut de la Garenne fire is now out of control, being fanned by political troublemakers, outside publicity seekers and lawyers and QCs with big pockets.

    The so-called victims will receive very little out of it. They are just pawns now. We have seen it all before with compensation schemes in Germany, Switzerland, Iraq and USA. Only the outside bigwigs benefit.

    Here we are fretting over the 3% GST on food. The poor Jersey taxpayer has seen nothing yet when it comes to paying for Stuart’s fire. Even Jersey itself may be destroyed in the process. What a mess!

    Villa Martinique, Chemin du Moulin, St Ouen.

    Article posted on 5th September, 2008 - 3.00pm

    Read more:

  17. Claire O'ConnellSeptember 03, 2011 2:28 pm

    In response to 'the care leavers have grown up and made their lives along time ago', I can only suggest that the ill-informed Astrid Kisch read this article -

    The original times online link has gone so just scroll down to the heading 'Jersey how many victims, abusers and government officials kept quiet?'.

    It is my Father's (Kevin O'Connell) account on what happened to him when he was a boy, he speaks also for his brother (Michael O'Connell) who cannot speak for himself, he hung himself a week after his 14th birthday. This is the only response I can offer to the blatant ignorance of this letter, quite frankly it has rendered me speechless! Perhaps I should invite the author of the letter to meet me to provide my own personal account on how my father made his life? No this would be futile, such ignorant views of a closed mind can never change..

  18. Thank you Claire for your courage in posting this shocking account, I am truly humbled xxx

  19. Claire O'ConnellSeptember 03, 2011 3:01 pm

    No Problem Ian. I am honestly still shell-shocked by what I have read. I thought by giving up anonymity it might get the message home to Mrs Kisch a little deeper.. I am acutely aware however that it is almost impossible to make the blind see! Thank you for your endeavours on raising awareness on such difficult issues that have been ignored for far too long, asking the right questions, and for having the courage to stand up and refusing to be lied to. If there is anything I can do to help, let me know. xx

  20. Two years ago, I had a letter published in the JEP in which I criticised the EEC and refered to them as the "Fourth Reich" as is my right, the abuse I received from Mrs. Astrid Kisch was unbeilevable, at one point she threatened to take action against me,
    I have a friend who suffered similar abuse from that horrible couple, as in my opinion, the husband is as bad, they are indeed a horrible family!

  21. Claire, I am so pleased that you have posted on Ian's blog. It takes courage to identify yourself and tell your story; my heart goes out to you and your family.

    One or two people have tried to defend Kisch, one saying that she is a very nice lady but in denial. What absolute tosh!! Her words were very carefully chosen; she deliberately set out to be cruel and callous and to cause the most amount of emotional damage to the survivor victims. Can you honestly say that this is the work of a “nice lady”? I think not!! Evil person.


  22. Claire O'ConnellSeptember 03, 2011 6:44 pm

    Hello Carrie,

    Thank you for your kind sentiments, I return my deepest compassion to you. You are an admirable and courageous advocate for survivors, a remarkable lady. Words fail me.

    I think it inexcusable to defend her very deliberate provocations. I have tried to post with as little emotion as possible to avoid stirring people into leaping to the defence of 'a nice old lady' and instead them seeing her words for what they are. As you say, callous and cruel. Because of her deliberate tone and clear intention to hurt others, openly belittling the horrific pain of what the survivors have endured, 'the tax payers expense', so shocking she even makes this relevant when commenting on such a harrowing issue. I have to wonder what is her purpose at all? Is she reaping the fruit of our disgust?

    The only comfort I can gain from this is there are very few people from her school of thought, thankfully.

    This lady and her ill-informed drivel should be given as little attention as possible. She is a minor distraction on a fundamental issue.


  23. Some time ago in the halcyon days of the BBC radio Jersey lunchtime phone-in, a woman referred to as Astrid of St Ouen rang.

    The call has always stuck in my memory.

    She was allowed an large amount of air time to explain, at length, how Hitler was just misunderstood. Apparently he only wanted a little bit more space for German speakers. No mention of how many millions suffered & died.

    Her warped re-writing of history was incredible. Not surprisingly, the host did not challenge any of her views. Instead he just chuckled embarrassingly.

  24. Some would actually defend Hitler because he was reportedly very kind to dogs.

    Astrid may be defended as a nice little old lady in the view of some, but she is obviously articulate enough to be of sound mind, and so should be held publicly responsible for the harm her intentionally public letter cruelly inflicts. She will, no doubt, arouse much sympathy within her tiny circle as a victim of an outraged wider public's criticism, despite the fact that she has no compassion for, say, innocent raped children.

  25. Astrid is a nazi and her husband is known as Mr Toad , he drives down to the yacht club in his old car ( goggles and cap )an image from a different generation.
    Has his tanker behind the bar for his own consummation , now there we have double standards, drinks a couple of pints and drives home,
    These people really are out of touch !

  26. While the letter was on display on letters to the editor (JEP) I noticed that IP addresses out side the UK was blocked, I tried to log on to Letters to the the ed from several pc´s here in Germany, but all were blocked. I rang a couple of people in the UK but were able to view the letters section, As this has happened a couple of times when something "explosive" was published. I ask is this the JEP doing some sort of censure, I thought that this sort of thing only happens in countries like China. Just a thought.

  27. Hello Germany, yes, the filthy rag block many countries from reading their online edition. America for example, have no access to the jersey evening post as far as I am aware.

    Welcome to Europe's China!!!

  28. They don't block access - you just need to pay to be a subscriber or buy an edition. I log onto to it from all around the world.

  29. Well I get it for free in jersey, the cut version, so why doesn't everyone else?

  30. Out of curiosity,when posting a comment on the JEP "Have your Say" a valid e-mail address is nacessary otherwise it will not be published, this is not so on any other blogs.
    My question is, if the SOJP or "Special Branch" asked the JEP for the e-mail address of any comments which were, by thier content obviously anti-establishment (me) and could be seen as a threat to the security of Jersey, would the JEP refuse to pass them on on the basis of the "Data Protection Law", or would an exception be made, on the grounds of "Island Security"?
    Am I being paranoid?

  31. Are you being paranoid? in a word, NO!!!

    Data Protection Laws are broken every single day in Jersey by the Establishment Party, one law for them, and the rest for us....